Don't understand myself...

[goldman24]

Hi I'm new to the board and I've been looking for a place where I can try to find some advice. sorry for the length of this post, I kind of let myself go...

Basically what I want is to understand myself better. I've just started college in January. Starting school in the middle of the year(I was accepted as a spring admit so I had no choice) has been tough, which I knew it would be, but after traveling in the fall I thought it would be easier. While traveling I discovered I had more energy than I thought I did. Because of high school I thought I had almost no social energy and would fail miseraly in college. High school was really not good for me, I had friends and everything, but I noticed that high school is not meant for introverts. Ridiculous start times early in the morning left me with very little sleep and that combined with no down time from 730-3 caused my energy levels to be extremely low and to have even less energy for class (making me look dumber than I already am whenever the teacher randomly called on me). Every year before school started I would tell myself pretty much the same thing: this is gonna be the year that I change, when l'll become in essence more extroverted, but at the time extroverted was replaced with words like more outgoing, or more outspoken in class, or be able to make jokes and say funny things in class and at the lunch table with everyone, or hang out with my friends more often. But it never changed. The dip in energy after the first couple weeks of the school year and the weekly fluctuations in energy still occurred. What I mean in energy I guess is social energy, and socially in high school the best day of the week was monday because I had had the weekend to re-energize. Jump-forward to the fall when after being accepted to my dream school (or what I thought was my dream school) for the spring semester and I had to find something to do with my time. The part of me that wanted a fundamental change in who I am, said something like "If I stay home and attend a community college and I won?t really have a social life I won't change at all. I need to force myself to change in someway in order to be happy in college." And so the change part of me won out and I went to Australia and New Zealand for two months. I had no idea what to expect, I simply committed myself to the belief that when I get back home, I will be a different person. And I thought it worked. I did things there that I never expected or even thought I could do. I travelled in a group in each country of about 10 or 11 people of different ages, and once they got over the fact that not every 18 year old American boy is immature and wild, I grew pretty close to some of them. I seemed to connect with every single one of them better than I did with most everyone from back home. I don't know why or how. I seemed to have way more social energy than I thought. Despite the fact that I was with people 24/7, there were very few occasions when I felt little social energy or that my social skills were off. We were going to bed very late and getting up early. I found that clubs and bars weren't the energy drains I expected them to be, as long as I was with people I felt comfortable with. I even danced, which I definitely thought I would never do. On my return flight back home I thought to myself "I'm happier with myself than I had ever been back home and I had just gotten through with what should have been an extremely draining period and I feel energized, almost ready to start school and see what I'll be like. " Lo and behold this is my 4th week of college and very little has changed from high school. I have more energy now for class because I usually have some time off in between classes, but the fact that there are so many people here (im at a big school) makes it very hard to make intimate connections with people. I'm experiencing the bottoming out of social energy. I have yet to wake up and feel as good as I did that one time in Australia when I had been out to a club until 330 and then got up at 630 the next morning to go into a rainforest. It doesn't make any sense to me. I have way more downtime now than when I was traveling. I thought I changed but I hadn't. I understand that at my core I'm an introvert. My goal has been to at least be able to act extroverted some of the time. I think it just helps in so many ways for college and not just socially. I had an interview the other day for a club/frat thing that I completely bombed. How am I supposed to get a job let alone find one that I?ll like? How am I supposed to get to know my teachers when I don't have the energy right now to be embarrassed and see my teacher in private when they don't even know my name? How am I supposed to make deep friendships when everyone is in a hurry to go somewhere or get something done? Basically I guess what I'm looking for is suggestions if anyone has any. If traveling is when I was happiest then obviously I need to travel more. And if I continue to be unhappy and not satisfied with life here do I transfer?  Maybe transfer to a school in another country? Would it be any different? and why did I have so much more energy while traveling than I do now?Also if anyone has any suggestions for introverts in college... I know that decisions I have to make are very important and can only be answered by me. But I've noticed for the most part throughout my life, that when I make tough choices on my own, I typically stay with what I know and so I know that if I'm not pushed or don't seek advice elsewhere that I'll stick with school here regardless of whether I?m happy or not

[Alex]

Well firstly, and most importantly ;-) - try to include paragraph intervals when writing.

Anyhow, to get to the point - there are several things that spring to mind here

1. You seem to suffer from some form of social anxiety - anxiety in the sense that you are anxious that the person you want people to see you as does not shine trough and then thoughts of this and trying to surpress your anxiety then perpetuates your anxiety so that you are in a constant anxious mood. I would really recommend you to take out the hour or so to listen to this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQKxwFXEpzQ&feature=related lecture

2. Secondly, accept that you are an introvert and that this is inborn. You can not will yourself to be extroverted even if you try, it is sort of similar to trying to change your dominant hand from left to right - whilst it might work for some time, ultimately though the effort is futile - just accept that you are born with a different temperament and that this requires more need for downtime (and inner reflection) than others

3. Thirdly, love yourself for who you are. You seem to try to want people to like you by being more funny, outgoing, cool and so forth. Whilst it is nice to have other people like you, the most important relationship you will have with anybody ever in your life will be with yourself - you are the one who will have spend time with yourself 24/7 day in day out, so you have to learn to be comfortable in your own skin and appreciate and love yourself for who you are, not what you think others want to perceive you as(and that you are afraid you can not live up to). Even if nobody likes you, you still have to like yourself - and drop being so perfectionistic - you are not perfect, nobody is - Remind yourself of this and then that it is ok still to be you even if imperfect. You had demonstrated that you are able to make friends and people like you for who you are - I bet these friendships developed because you felt you could be yourself around them and thereby relax when in company. The same applies for anyother company - don't think so much as how you can come across as witty and cool - just try to go with the flow and relax and be yourself.

On a more practical level with regards to this, try to associate with people that you identify with. I for one have learnt that I can never really click or keep up with wild extroverts - in fact, I am not interested in their company nor do I need their blessing. If I have the choice between going to a party or sit at home and read a good book, generally I find reading the book a lot more rewarding. I would recommend you to consider the latter and see if it is not possible to go to and participate in more quiet venues where there are other young people like you - and whether you actually won't find that a lot more rewarding - say like playing dungeons or dragons for an evening rather than go to a rowdy club. Introverts are often also very sensitive so all that noise and commotion, constant chatter, selling of oneself is usually quite nerve wracking and will leave you completely exhausted - Learn to accept there are other ways to interact that likely are more enjoyable for you and that there are a lot of other people similar to you.
Just because they are not as noisy, visible and dominating space like extroverts doesn't mean that people similar to you don't exist and that you won't find their company a lot more rewarding and where you will be appreciated a lot more for who you are which ultimately will also be more beneficial for your selfesteem. When introverts try to act like they are extroverted, they often just comes across as rather weird. If you dare, consider even to cut off extroverts from your world(apart from of course family and friends) - you might see you can live life quite fullfillingly without having to live up their standards.

You will be happy when you start to accept and appreciate yourself just like you are

Good luck

PS:  The likely reason You had more energy when you were traveling was because you could be yourself - also around other people. Being in a foreign environment where nobody knows you probably also helped in the sense that you didn't feel you had to fight against maybe a perceived preconception of you and trying to turn that around. Trying to fight against your nature is what causes exhaustion - so simply by being comfortable in your own skin and around other people gave you the extra energy. Transferring to another school will just repeat the same problems you have now which will continue until you make peace with yourself

[Orion]

Hi goldman,

Just curious -- do you feel the "system" bogs you down? It struck a chord with me that you were excited by going to visit the rainforest, while school is what tires you. Could it be that a "system" which is created to bog you down into a scheduled life (on the macro level -- high school, college, jobs) be the existential issue?

As an introvert, I have always dreamed what it would be like to just live a life of a nomad.

I am in a bit of an existential rut myself, I can't seem to decide whether to take action in the system that is built around me, or if I'd be happier with a "nomadic" life, and lose a sense of "system-built" accomplishment.

Do you find yourself to harbor a restless nature that hates rigid scheduling and repetitiveness? (i.e. scheduled classes with down time in between, jobs (getting up at 8 coming home at 6 etc)).

I wonder if some introverts would be better off just wandering around the world aimlessly with no ultimate goals at all.

The reason I mention this is that I had a similar experience where before I began college I went on a trip to a place totally different from my home, and I felt energy I have never felt since. The reason I think - when I look back - that I had so much energy on that trip, was that I was doing what I wanted. I had no restrictions on mobility, I had no long term goals to worry about....I was just taking everything in....the smells, the architecture, etc...."tomorrow" as a concept was not hovering over my head, so I was basking in the day-to-day enjoyment of everything.

College DOES hover over your head. There are EXPECTATIONS. This drives existential chaos in the form of preparation for "tomorrow" and "your career".  NO ONE was (at least for me) expecting ANYTHING of me during my trip abroad. I truly felt free, and set loose from the shackles and chains.

[goldman24]

Thanks guys and my bad about the paragraphing... i've never posted on a forum before

Alex- I listened to the video and yes I agree I with you I seem to be suffering from some sort of social anxiety. One of my main worries i think is what people think of me e.g i'm sharing a room with 3 other kids and I've been worrying about what they think of me, that they don't like me and that they think i'm a loser. Somehow (i'm trying to remember how y i think this) I think that two of them don't like me and don't think anything of me. So I've tried to say things or do things that i think would make them like me more.

Its a bad circle. I had thoughts going in that my roommates wouldn?t like and understand me. Then I assumed that certain things they did involving me, they did because they didn't like me. Then I tried to say or do things that I thought might make them like me more, and that may have actually caused them to not like me since i wasn't being myself and most people can see through that. I?ve found in most social situations with people i?m not comfortable with, I try to say stuff that I think people want to here or would react well to because I'm so worried about what people think of me.  i'm definitely gonna research social anxiety more and use some of those 7 steps...

I'm trying to learn how to accept who I am- it'll take some time but I think i'll get there eventually

I haven't been friends with a definite extrovert since i was 11- i don't know if i will ever have another one. i've always felt more comfortable to be myself around other introverts, but sometimes they are difficult to find...

Orion- yes living life as a nomad with no expectations does sound kind of interesting

i also dislike schedules. im not sure if this is the main problem but its definitely a contributing factor. for me  it seems to be that i have way less energy in a schedule. not only does it bog me down and limit myself to doing things i may not want to do but schedules they just make me bored and tired of doing the same routine, making it harder to get myself excited and energized about the day. this was definitely true in HS. i?ve also realized now that schedules make me worry more...

When i know whats coming i spend a lot of time preparing myself for it and that puts pressure and expectations on myself.  i think in a schedule like in high school i waste energy because i spend time trying to prepare myself for what to expect. e.g. when I have a class where a teacher randomly calls on students, i became more worried about the teacher calling on me than on the actual subject and that makes it difficult to actually enjoy the class. its the same for tests, interviews, and social gatherings.

I worry more in a scheduled environment because I know that since I?m an introvert, i?m very slow on my feet and so i think i have to be prepared for every possible social situation i might encounter when of course, the actual preparing and worrying of what to expect wastes energy, and it?s also almost impossible to predict how social situations will play out.

I felt the same way about travelling. i had no idea what to expect from day-to-day and no one expected me to really accomplish anything from the trip. no expectations=no worries=more fun and energy to do things 

ive occasionally thought about just giving up college life as a lost cause and moving to Australia and just experiencing life w/o any idea of where i'll go next. i doubt i'll do that but its an interesting thought...

thanks a lot guys i feel like i?m making a lot of progress in understanding myself better

[FallenofTrack]

To goldman, I have had some similar experiences and feelings.  I struggled with social anxiety when I was in high school, in addition to being a highly expressed introvert. The social anxiety decreased a lot after high school, but I'll always be an introvert, and I've come to accept that.
I know that I don't like rigid schedules and limitations placed on me.  I am quiet but I have a wild sense about me.  I want to be able to do what I want to do without worrying about schedules and commitments.  Like you, I also have a tendancy to get stressed out when I feel obligated to do things.

There have also been times when I felt a lot of energy around certain people.  I felt more alive and wanting to experience everything.  I was energized by the experiences instead of feeling drained. But those were rare occasions when I felt completely comfortable around the people who were participating in those experiences.  I tend to feel more understood around free-spirited people, people who just don't feel that sense of obligation to live by other peoples expectations and rules. I guess I like it when things are a bit unpredictable instead of a lot of structure.  I don't do well with structure.

I think it's important that you realize that it is ok to change your mind every now and again.  I know that there are some negative labels that get thrown out when someone changes his or her mind, but I am one of those people who sees nothing wrong with doing that.  Because if you never change your mind, you end up getting bogged down by things and it doesn't allow you to make changes when you are feeling unsatisfied with something.   You have to remember that in the end, it is your life that is being affected.  If you make a bad decision on something, sometimes there is a way to fix it, instead of always taking a rigid stance once you do make a decision.

[Alex]

Goldman - You state very clearly that you are concerned what others think of you and this continues to ruminate with you and this ruminating makes you anxious and deenergized. This is textbook social anxiety and I think you will find the Leahy lectures very useful and your experiences well documented here.

I can also recommend to read or listen to his books, but it is basically the same 7 points as listed in these lectures that are repeated again and again(however, it is only valuable to have them repeated and reinforced). In order for something to really stick with you I think it is a good rule of thumb to go over it 3 times, so you might want to consider to listen to these lectures 2 more times just to make the concepts(which are based on cognitive psychology) stick.

You should appreciate that you are well on the way to recovery, if I may be a bit frank. The first and most difficult step is always to acknowledge that you might have a problem and then reach out for help. As a buddhist saying goes, When the student is ready, the teacher will appear. What you are experiencing is very common - especially amongst people who are more on the shy side - what then often occurs as with you is that trying not to be shy, just makes the situation worse, because you always have whatever you are trying to fight at the back of your head - for example trying not to appear anxious, just makes you more anxious. As Leahy advocates, try instead as a new tactic not to fight your anxiety and even consciously delve into it and seek out experiences that you know will make you anxious. To quote Leahy, think of being in a river with regards to anxiety - instead of fighting against the stream, just let yourself float along. Once you start making a practice of this you will soon learn that your anxiety will fade and you will be a lot less anxious on a general level. Leahy proposes to think of anxiety as a companion you have with you whereever you go and you and don't surpress him, even if he can be annoying - it is again, to repeat, trying to surpress anxiety which even if it might seem counterintuitive, that makes anxiety worse. (And in case you are wondering, I am speaking of personal experience and I found studying Leahy extremely helpful)

Finally, you state and I suspected this already - you are very concerned about what people think of you - and you try therefore to do your best to give a good impression. As I wrote in my previous post, learn to accept that you have a different inborn hardwired temperament by being introverted and that it is futile to try to revert this. As I said before, if an introvert tries to act or simulate that he is an extrovert, often he just comes across as weird(and with the expected detrimental results for his selfesteem). This might be a grand statement to make again, but learn to love yourself just like you are, warts and all. When you love and appreciate yourself you will be less concerned with what others think of you - because you know that their opinion whether it is real or perceived will not change your own positive image of yourself. If this might sound hard to begin with, try to see if you can't see yourself from the outside as a 3rd party and whether if you were a 3rd party you wouldn't want to be friends with you - I bet you would want to and that you would like the person you see

Good luck

PS: And good job on the paragrahps ;-)

[radames]

Hello Goldman24,

Welcome to the forums!  I know exactly what you mean when you say that you feel bogged down by the "system." I remember when I moved away from home 2000 miles from all that I had known and it seemed that I had this new energy. 

I had my own little project of "becoming a man" in my own right.  I saved the money necessary, I had a roommate move with me, and I had a successful transition into my "new life."  Of course, there were some difficulties, my job didn't pan out and I had to frenziedly rush around to find work in an expensive new area, but I made it work!  Nothing can substitute for the energy you feel when you take control of your own life and destiny.

After I while I felt crushed under the weight of financial lack.  However, I met a good friend in the new job and we supported one another as artists.  I became his roommate for a while as he had a house, but I couldn't dismiss the deep feeling that I was missing my siblings and parents back home.  I decided to return home "chocking up" my experience as a time of refinement and growth.

I think that a lot of the time we have a certain area of emphasis that focus on when we learn things in life.  In other words, we get hyperfocused on one perspective.  All in all, we don't realize that there are other perspectives and vantage points in which we can learn a lot as well!  You focused on how you felt when you traveled, how you interacted with others, how you felt energized and alive, yet maybe there was a subtler level of feeling that you missed that indicated that something was "off."

It shouldn't matter where you are in life geographically or socially.  You will still be who you are in all situations.  If however you are convinced that who you should be is defined by what others think and expect of you, then you live a life that is very stressed and depressing.  In essence, it seems that we are all hard-wired to cater our actions to the preference and comfort of others regardless of how we feel about it.  We need to be "rebellious" in a sort of way to the invasive manner that others use to try to control us.

I remember last night as I worked out that another man entered the facility and asked me about what I was watching.  Frankly put, I was finishing a show and as it ended he had stated the question, to which I replied in as courteous a manner that I was not watching much.  I was trying to be fair in order to allow him to watch something as I had just finished my own show.  I would have expected him to allow me to watch a show of my own after he had finished his but this was not going to happen, and didn't happen. 

He was a very aggressive, outgoing person.  He was the kind of guy who had an unnaturally loud voice and imposing attitude yet not overwhelming but just enough that you could tell that he could get what he wanted.

I usually concede in these situations and make a conscious decision to allow the environment to be peaceful rather than stressful.  I am very sensitive to my environment and will escape it if I am oppressed.

In school you may have encountered these kinds of people and feel the stress of having to perform in order for them to like you.  While you were traveling the rain forest automatically accepted you for who you were rather than making you feel judged or belittled because you weren't the "life of the party."  When we go out into nature, especially raw and uncorrupted nature, we feel its connection and soothing force.  I am not trying to promote any kind of "green" situation here, but it is good to slow down at times and enjoy the lower vibrations that are overwhelmed in this fast-paced world.

I think that you had the dominating effect of the environment working in your favor while you spent time with your companions on the trip.  In that situation, your mind was in a very peaceful, relaxed mode of operandus and this allowed your personality and spirit to come out freely.  On the other hand, with school and the oppressiveness of cities and traffic and construction and the like, even if we have people who are exactly like us and understand us through and through, with whom we can spend hours talking, it is a struggle to really enjoy ourselves and feel free to be ourselves in these times.

Imagine being at a restaurant, at an outside table, trying to converse with your best friend while construction and rush-hour traffic is blaring at you both.  Now imagine meeting a stranger in a lush, quiet picturesque setting that gives "peace and quiet" a newly profound meaning, soothing your soul, melting the stress even out of the atoms at the core of your being.  In essence, that stranger could be made your "best friend" because of the state of being your mind and emotions are in at that moment.

Anyway, I am fairly long-winded and just wanted to share my opinion and welcome you to the site!

As we know, life is a process, a learning one at that, and we have the freedom to learn at our own pace and even fail every once in a while (as long as we strive to reclaim success quickly).  In fact, failure and success are purely subjective, in my opinion.  The only way I think that we fail is if we are not living in our own shoes and are trying to fit in the shoes of society.

[shelby]

I totally get the travelling thing - I love to travel and am a completely different person on vacations - free and even a bit wild, spontaneous, etc. I love being around strangers who don't know me, as I can truly be myself, because no one is judging you. It's strange, and seems incongruous with introvert behavior - we aren't supposed to like new things! Same old, same old, right?...- but it works like that for me too. I wish I understood it better myself - I think that we are such private people and don't like to open up - but in real life, the more we get to know the same people, the more they expect us to open up, which creates conflict within us, and I think, makes us turn inward - mostly to escape from further intimacy.

When we travel and see new sights, and meet new people, it's usually fleeting, and most of the time, we'll never see them again, so if we are ourselves, and they don't like us, so what? We'll never see them again if we don't want to. Unfortunately, in real life, we can't avoid everybody who doesn't like us, or vice versa - especially in a daily work or school situation.

[druidkat7]

Oh, yeah....I do hear what you are saying...I've been DYING to live in the UK for a while to see what it's like...oh, I'll still be an "ambivert." I'm not much for pubs or bars...but just to have, say a rented/leased cottage in the country for a while so I can go around England and Scotland on my own, visit my ancestral lands, my fave musician's birthplace, and so on...that would allow me to cross over into the Other Side a near-completely happy woman...

Honestly, though, the "system" here DOES seem a bit obsessed with schedules and whatnot...I've never quite understood it...

There is a Greek word for operating more on "God's timeline" which is, to say, no time at all. It's called "kairos." And I am willing to bet alarm clocks to snooze buttons that we innies and even ambiverts are more tuned into "kairos" than the extroverts are. I can be extroverted, but above all, I AM a Sensitive, which puts me at least on the edge of being a solid, if not highly expressed "innie."

And I, too, would love to travel with no limitations...I despise the idea of tour groups, forcing you to do what the group wants to do, when maybe all you want to do for the day is meditate by a waterfall, or browse a bazaar at length...by yourself.