HELP: Innie Male with Outtie Female

[Unknown]

I am reading The Introvert Advantage as a request from my innie husband to understand him on his level. There are some great points which have helped me to open my eyes to his world. However, there are so many things that I am confused and frustrated about.

My husband is an ?innie? and on top of it, he is the one with the power in our relationship. It has gotten to the point where being an introvert for him has become his excuse for everything.  He walks around with an attitude where he expects me (his wife) to work around him or accept him for who he is. It?s frustrating in a sense, because many times, I feel that he is a hypocrite. He will make or give reasons to justify himself?many of them coming back to the fact that is an introvert and he?s not letting ?them? (me and all the other extroverts) tell him he is ?crazy.? He has said to me that he is more than willing to open up to me but I would have to do the work because of the oppression (for the lack of better words) he?s endured from us extroverted people. I can understand how angry he is over three decades, however, he has always been the one in control of our relationship?everything he wants, he gets. I see him as a very selfish person because I have done most of the work in our relationship. I am the one to always apologize first. I give him everything he wants because I don?t want him to think that I?m also against him. However, I feel that the day I give up, our relationship will end as well. I have a lot of resentment towards him because he is part of the problem and refuses to acknowledge it.

Can anyone help me understand him?especially if you are an innie male with a lot of dominant characteristics.

[Alex]

Can you provide some examples, it will make it easier to answer your question

[Unknown]

In a recent argument that we had, I was explaining to my husband about how he also has to put effort into our relationship for it to work. He explained to me that our relationship has no emotional connection. The thing is, we spend so much time together (more than most other couples) and we get along great on a friendship level. However, whenever he finds a new hobby, I feel like he is trying to force me into the same hobby. He thinks if we do it together, then we connect. An example of this would be working out. He recently started working out again and soon started commenting on the fact that I also needed to work out because it would help him be more attracted to me-physically and emotionally. On that note, let me just say that I am not the best looking girl but on a daily basis, I receive comments from other men that I look good and I am not overweight. Anyway, because I refuse to workout he goes into this stage where he starts ignoring me. When I try to talk to him, all he can say is that as an introvert, he keeps to himself and if I?m trying to help him then I need to learn how to understand him. He?ll also say things like, ?because ?you? people don?t get it.?
Another example I could use is our ?going out? issue. We?re both still young (he?s 30 and I?m 26). When I go out with my girls, 4 out of 5, he is either 1) there with me or 2) in the same part of town. He?ll call me all these nasty names because he doesn?t like me going out. He?s told me before that my reasons for going out are not legit because the people I hang with are not important and they are unmarried girls. He, on the other hand, party hard when he was my age. He still goes out more than me with his single cousins. His excuse is that 1) they are family and 2) he?s meeting with people to ?network.? Within this year, I could easily count the number of times I?ve gone out on one hand.

I get that introverts do things on a different level than us extroverts. I go out because I want to catch up with my friends. He goes out because the person he is meeting could help him get a job somewhere. Regardless of what the situation is, he is the one who ends up drunk and acting a fool. I feel that this is a double standard and it always comes back to me ?not understanding? him.

 My husband never got along with his parents until recently this year. He still has problems with his younger brother and kicked him out. His reason was because the younger brother didn?t know how to be a younger brother. He on the other hand, has never been an older brother. I feel like my husband is trying to punish me and other people because of the depression he went through his entire life feeling like he was different. He expects us to know our part but finds excuses for him not putting any effort into making things right.

[flame]

Hi.

Not sure what to say, Unknown?

He sounds like he is acting like an A-hole from what you've said...but since we are only hearing your side of the story, it is hard to get a balanced overview of the situation. Couples counselling might be your best bet?

 It sounds like he considers his position to be justified, so there's not much you can do about that, except to counter-act it every time he makes excuses for his behaviour by saying that his excuses aren't going to hold any more water with you...and punishing you for the past isn't going to do anything but push you away and destroy the relationship and if that's what he wants to do...well you can't do anything about it, but let him realise his mistakes in his own time.
 His self-righteousness may be getting in the way of any real communication between the two of you. It also sounds like he is trying to make you out to be the one that needs to work on yourself, and that's a neat trick to take the focus off his own flaws and faults
 It sounds like you are at least willing and wanting to understand him more...maybe he needs to give you more credit and do the same towards you instead of acting like a spoilt baby!

[Unknown]

I remember that in The Introvert Advantage, Marti talked about how an Innie male and an outtie female relationship is a little more difficult than others.

In my relationship, I find it difficult because my husband, on top of being an innie, is so dominant. It's dificult to grasp him because he doesn't seem to care at all about what or how people precieve him. And i know this could be a result of him caring for a long time without any good coming out of it. The thing is that, if he KNOWS better..and he KNOWS that people may take him the wrong way or think of him differently, he should find ways (like the book suggests) to communicate so that it is effective.

I don't understand why that is such a hard concept for him to understand. When I try to reason with him, I feel as if EVERYTHING gets turned around. He would acknowledge at times that I have good points but then explains that the result of his doing is because of me and thus, as an introvert, that is just the way he responds.

I've been in relationships where I've had full power so I can at times understand his behavior. What i just don't get is his "introvert" attitude and I refuse to be blamed for...especially when I'm the one ALWAYS trying to make things right.

In our last arguement, i told him that I will not be blamed for his actions anymore and that he better start taking responsibility for his actions...REGARDLESS of his past. He simply just said to me, "well, what are you going to do about it? It's who I am." I sort of gave him an ultimatium....i can't live with it so he can either leave the relationship or go with me to get counseling. He said he would do what I wanted because "that was the only way to make things right if you get what you want." I feel like i am talking to a 13 year old a lot of the time.

[Alex]

He explained to me that our relationship has no emotional connection.
I feel like he is trying to force me into the same hobby.
...soon started commenting on the fact that I also needed to work out because it would help him be more attracted to me-physically and emotionally.
...because you people dont get it.
When I go out with my girls  He'll call me all these nasty names because he doesn't like me going out.
He's told me before that my reasons for going out are not legit because the people I hang with are not important and they are unmarried girls. He, on the other hand, party hard when he was my age. He still goes out more than me with his single cousins. Within this year, I could easily count the number of times I've gone out on one hand.
He goes out because the person he is meeting could help him get a job somewhere
My husband never got along with his parents until recently this year
I feel that this is a double standard and it always comes back to me ?not understanding? him.
He still has problems with his younger brother and kicked him out - His reason was because the younger brother didn?t know how to be a younger brother.
I feel like my husband is trying to punish me and other people because of the depression he went through his entire life feeling like he was different.

I just put together some of your direct quotes. Try to look at these as if you were a third person and it sounds like your husband has some (bully) issues and frankly speaking doesn't sound like a very nice guy. I think you should have a good hard look at your relationship and decide with yourself whether you find this relationship rewarding - and I would definantly suggest you seek marriage counseling.

His behaviour has nothing to do with introversion - Rather is seems like he is just using this as an excuse to behave in an egotistical manner. I've said this before and maybe I am wrong, but I actually feel introverts generally speaking often are more considerate than extroverts - your husband seems to be focused only on his own needs which points more to having narcissistic issues rather than introvert characteristics - I think You might even want to reconsider whether he is an introvert at all, for example most introverts strongly dislike to go partying unlike your husband apparently.

Good luck

[radames]

I agree with most of the comments previously stated.  It sounds like he has some growing up to do.  It sounds like he is 30 years old physically and 13 years old emotionally.  This is typical because women USUALLY mature much faster than guys emotionally because their emotional expression is expected and supported in our society while men appear weak if they show emotion.

I am married to an outie woman and it truly is difficult to smoothly and peaceably relate to her a lot of times but as long as we are able to understand that we aren't perfect, are able to openly communicate even in the tough times, and are truly dedicated t our commitment, we have a slight edge on making it for the long haul.

I think he still sees you as one of his college buddies rather than his spouse.  He may not really know what it means to be vulnerable and compromising in an emotionally healthy and thriving marriage.  You may feel more like a mother to him rather than the other half of a team.  If this is the case then you have to decide if he is worth the stress of waiting to see if he will mature and meet you halfway.  Maybe you can ask yourself if establishing ultimatums is the BEST and most effective course of action.  Maybe you can picture what a healthy marriage looks like to you and see how much of it he accepts.  What is your vision for this marriage?  Are you a victim of marriage or its benefactor and initiator?

There can be mature and immature innies AND outies.  A commitment isn't based on typology but maturity.  Has he gone through the tough times of life that threaten his "manhood" or his strength?  Have you?  Has he gone through perspective-changing times that threatened his survival and sanity?  Have you?  A lot of times having a child turns immature boys and girls into somewhat mature men and women.  Other things can bring about personal growth such as financial crises, sicknesses, losing something you love dearly, and the like.  This brings a person to the depths of themselves to see what is at the core.  They will crumble or move forward but they WON'T remain the same.  

Adversity sharpens and strengthens us no matter how much we deny it.  It is how we respond to these changes that brings us to appreciate life or to be the victim of life.  We all go through this on one level or another.  We all have victories and failures.  Seeing marriage as a tool to help us in this journey, as a kind of mirror, is a wise mindset in my opinion.  It is not easy but can bring great rewards over time.

I am not favoring him or you but am encouraging you both to see the potential for a rewarding life in each other.  There will be tough times but you knew that.  You both need the adversity to receive the rewards.  Do you want the adversity or challenges to find you or do you want to "take them by the horns?"

I think that speaking frankly and openly without judgment is the first step.  Saying how something makes you feel without pointing fingers can reveal a lot about the person listening.  If one pays close enough attention and, as Alex said, become a third person witnessing the venting then one can learn a whole lot about one's self.  For example, it's not so much, "what you said about my personality was very insulting" but "I believe I have a lot of good qualities in my personality and I know I'm not perfect.  This is where I am in life right now and I'm still learning what I want and need.  I am who I am and will be honest with that but change will have to come through time.  I need your patience."  The issue is being discussed but with no blame.  If you don't have the freedom to do that then are you really in a marriage or are you just around each other for selfish reasons?

This is what the voices in my head are telling me anyway.    Thinking is one thing but doing is a whole other thing.  Best of luck to you both.

[Unknown]

Radames,

Your post has been extremely helpful. My husband is an innie with anger problems. When he was young, he partied and did drugs. I can honestly say that he has come such a long way. His family (parents, siblings, cousins, aunts and uncles) have told me that they can see how much I have helped turned his life around in a more positive direction. I feel that if i give up on him, then he would be hopeless. He would return to hating people who care about him.

I find it surprising that you mentiond how he still sees me as one of his buddies rather than spouse. Throughout this entire year, i have mentioned that same issue to him. I feel as if we are roommates but NOT husband and wife. I know he cares about me because we've been together for almost 7 years, however, I don't know if he has ever truely loved me. "Power is with the person who cares less." Maybe it is selfishness why I married him. I loved him too much and could not bare him being with anyone else. I can't speak for him but i feel that he married me because I am giver. It is easy for me to care about others/strangers and openly give what i can. Because of my personality and easy going, he must of felt very comfortable being with me.

Overall, I feel that we are having marriage problems because I'm starting to stick up for myself. By trying to be equal to him, it threathens his emotional control on me. On top of it, we do have very different backgrounds. We both grew up poor but I grew up KNOWING that my parents loved me. He grew up thinking his parent's did not love him and that lead him to the street life.

I feel that I am going beyond to make things work...but it is really hurtful for me to know that, I always have to make that first effort. He can't even appreciate even something that little.

Recently he asked me what I was passionate about. He wanted to know why I don't have any hobbies. I tried to explain to him that the hobbies I want to do cost money..money that we don't have. I sacrifice things i enjoy doing like shopping, getting make-overs, etc., so that he can do his hobbies. When he is into something...it's pretty extreme...he has to know everything about the subject. He's bought two dogs over the past 3 years and joined protection training club that costs $400 a year. He doesn't understand why...if i was truely passionate about something, that I would find a way to do it. Anyway, his whole point was to build an emotional connection with substance. In the end, it basically came down to me not making the decision to do something i love doing.

I could go on but it just seems like i am talking bad about him.

Thank you to everyone who has responded. And i encourage anyone else to write as well if you can offer any advice. Thanks.

[flame]

I'm sure you know him better than any of us do, but I can't help but agree with Alex's last post, and it mirrors some thoughts that came to me yesterday, that he seems to be using the whole Introvert thing as an excuse to get away with unacceptable behaviour. I also wondered whether he is an introvert at all, since networking isn't something we are all that comfortable doing, which you said he spent alot of time doing!

 People with Narcissistic personality Disorder do tend to pick partners who are givers, as you described yourself.
 I'm not saying this is the case with your husband, as I'm not an expert, but his behaviour sure does sound similar to my mother, who has a very strong Narcissistic streak in her, and my father for that matter (though it could be that she has taken on aspects of his disorder unconsciously after being married to him for so long??)

 It's good that you are starting to stick up for yourself, and I'm sure it is causing him to feel a loss of power over you, but I think it would be wise if you kept it up until he gets use to it...if you stop now it will only give the message to him that you aren't really serious and he can go back to the old way of behaving towards you.
 Teach him that you mean business and you will be able to achieve what you have set out to create in your relationship...but I wouldn't expect him to just lie down and take it...he will put up a fight until he is used to the new change...all power to you!

[pyro13g]

He has a trust issue to deal with on top of everything else.  He is using Introversion as an excuse to control and relieve stress the lack of trust creates. Being Introverted is not an excuse for what's going on.  No matter what the personalities are, it's a two way street.

You can use most of that book he wants you to read, against him and his behavior, along with any other book on relationships.

You gotta ask yourself, If you don't bow to his every request, is violence next?  Or has there already been some?  The distrust, sometimes drunkenness (he's self medicating), anger, demands, very hurtful comments (names are one thing, but saying he has no emotional connection to you - WTF), are some strong warning signs that it  has potential to get physically violent.  It often comes next when the verbal demands are not met. through booze in the equation and the inhibitions loosen.  

If I would hear "there's no emotional connection between us" from a spouse, I'd be packing one of us up to move out.  Wait, I did do that.

Maybe some time away to think, both you and him.

I don't think marriage counseling will go well.  He will pull the same with the counselor when he feels threatened or attacked and that response is not coming from being married.  It's coming from another place and he needs to deal with that to start seeing the light in regards to the marriage.

[Unknown]

Pyrol13g,

I've tried to use book as my weapon to call out his actions...but maybe i'm not strong enough because he ends up turning the situation around. Also, you are right when you talked about the trust issue. When i get frustrated, I will ask for help..just like this, and when he finds out that I've been talking about him, he will say to me that he can't trust me. I try to explain to him that sometimes talking about my issues with close individuals (99% of the time it's his sister), it helps me to not be so angry at him. I have never spoke bad of him to my side of the family because I would never want my family to feel that he does not love me.

About the "no emotional connection" thing....I was so hurt by it that I ended up not sleeping in the same room with him for 5 days..and during those 5 days, which were recent, I also choose not to talk to him. I think that got him to realize that I really meant what I said because he actually tried to be nice to me by asking me about my day, etc., and not being offended when i gave him one worded answers.

About marriage counseling, I have already set up an appointment. I am also very scared about it. My husband is not a big fan of people who try to "diagnose" him. When he was young, his parents took him to see a pychologist and that didn't work out. I've told the few pychologist I've spoken to that I will be very picky. I've schedule a few sessions with different pychologists to see which one my husband feels is the right fit for him. For so long i was afraid to see anyone because if it didn't work out, and no one could help us, then the only path left is to go our seperate ways...I wasn't ready for that. But now, even if counseling will only make it worst, I feel that I have to do everything I can in hopes that something will work before I call it quits.

I know that on the deeper level of all this, he has personal issues that he can't seem to overcome. He doesn't know how to truely forgive people who have hurt him in the past and therefore, he lives with the problems that he does.

Anyway, I will update you guys on Wednesday of next week after our first session with a counselor. Thank you!!




Flame,

Thank you for making me feel better about the situation. I appreciate all the help that you have shown me through this forum!

[flame]

It's a pleasure Unknown, and I hear what you are saying about him not knowing how to forgive.

 Forgiveness isn't as easy as everyone makes it out to be...it's a process, sometimes a long one. It might help your husband if you remind him that all he has to do to start this process is be WILLING to forgive.
 It sounds like now he is grasping onto the pain of the past because it's been there so long that he doesn't really know how to live without it! It's become such a part of his daily life, that he is punishing himself with it, and punishing YOU as well.
 Maybe if you can help him to realise that by holding onto it, he is perpetuating the pain and abuse that was imposed on him, and that if he changes the way he views forgiveness, so that it's no longer about lettling them get away with it, and more about doing it for himself and his own peace of mind...that may put a chink in his armour? A compassionate heart tempered with firm boundaries may be the way to handle him at this stage?

Good luck with it...it's not easy to see someone you love in pain.

[InnerVantage]

Hi Unknown,

I've noticed that innies can lean toward co-dependency. Have you considered that yet?

[flame]

I know this wasn't directed at me, but I thought it needed to be mentioned that co-dependency is something pretty much everyone has issues with at one time or another...it isn't something exclusive to just introverts...in fact, I would think it would be the other way around, seeing as we are usually pretty good keeping our own company, which leads to potentially knowing ourselves better than extroverts do, since we find quietness and introspection a natural environment, like a fish does to water...we are less likely to overly-depend on others I would think?

[InnerVantage]

Hi FLame,

I get where you are coming from on the co-dependecy issue -- our independence and all. I agree with that point.

However, it's because of our relating to ourselves that we can slip into co-dependency when we get into relationships, especially love relationships. We lack lots of experience at this type of relating and can pick up some bad patterns simply by watching others, movies, TV, etc.

At least that's what I've noticed by knowing others of our type.