The introverted process in learning

[Nanook]

As introverts go, I've been fortunate...grew up in a mostly introverted family, in a culture which respected introverted behaviour (Canadian eastern Arctic/inuit), and in a context which allowed me to recognize by my late teens, as I began to engage with the mainstream southern Canadian/North American culture in university, that what I was, was introverted, and that this was a perfectly legitimate way to be.  That context also forced me to develop a wide variety of communication skills, including public speaking, which have served me well when it's come to getting on personally and professionally with the extroverted majority.  All of which takes the long way round to saying that while I found this book interesting, and think I am likely to find more in it to be personally applicable as time goes on, happily most of it wasn't the revelation for me, that I suspect it could be for a lot of 'normal' introverts--and perhaps more importantly, the extroverts they have to contend with!

However:  I did find the material on physiology extremely interesting, as it applies to the process of taking in and processing information.  It rather validates the strategies I've worked out for myself over the years, for learning--most recently, during a 3-years return to college to retrain as a computer programmer--and makes sense of the differences I've seen in classrooms, meetings, and lectures for 25 years now, between my own and majority 'normal' processing.  The key being, that I have always experienced my own process as much slower.  In any sort of information session, I have learned to operate with no hope whatever of absorbing any information fully during the presentation.  My focus is best placed on getting down the information presented as completely as possible, as nearly in verbatim transcript as possible, so that I can sit down and go over it quietly, by myself, later.  It is only by doing this at least once--again, a fairly slow, plodding process, and it helps if I do it two or three times, with overnights or naps between sessions--that I get to what I think I will call the same apparent level of understanding that my more extroverted colleagues do.  I say 'apparent', because while there seems no doubt they integrate facts and recognize implications more quickly--the questions they are in a position to ask at the end of an hour's classroom session, will typically not even begin to occur to me until days later--by the time my process reaches the point of raising those questions, it will typically be presenting the answers as well (no need to ask) and in the long run my understanding is likely to be more thorough.  Interesting to think it could come down to physical causes.

[terrylee]

Nanook,



I like your ideas about processing speed. Although I have degrees and research on my resume, I am currently working towards a credential to teach math in middle or high school. Some of the class activities in this program are geared towards elementary classrooms and I find that they desire a quick and superficial response. Sort of like, just keep the activity rolling, it does not matter if it makes any sense or has any learning significance....As the class flits from topic and activity to the next, I feel like asking to let our discussion slowly sink down through the several levels to see what is there and how it works. I certainly understand that all of the extroverts will need continuous input, but in math there is also an innie growth realm which I think needs to be talked about by all students in their new mathematical language. I would like to add innie and outty to learning and processing styles. Thanks for your insights!

[Marti Laney]

Hi, boy you-all are noodling about fascinating aspects of introverting--and you-all are so right about our innie learning style -- a friend of mine went to college in Britain and he said they actually expect you to sit and stare and cogitate about what you are learning--sounds great doesn't it?  Thanks for your thoughts--Love, Marti

[mdfa]

I realize this is kind of an old topic but it struck a cord with me. Years ago, when I was in university and had no idea that I was an introvert and what that entailed, I observed something very interesting and disturbing. I went to all the lectures in psychology course, took copious notes, read them each day. Though I found this approach very boring and, therefore, not stimulating - I had a hard time remembering anything!



And then there was my EXTREMELY, and I mean pathologically, extroverted roommate who was in the same course. She never attended lectures, looked at no notes, spent most of her time partying and searching for new guys... Two days before the exam she started reading our psychology book. Taking short breaks she read the whole thing in 48 hrs, went into the test, and got 95%. I got 65%... Life sometimes is unfair.

[innette]

Oh, I totally relate to Nanook's post about never getting anything out of oral presentations.  Sometimes people mock me for taking notes in meetings or classes where retaining information is not important (eg, in a presentation where we needed to critique another student's presentation, as if I could even TAKE IN the information, let alone tell her how she could improve on it!!) but honestly, it's the only way I'd have any idea of what was said.

Is this totally related to introversion though?  I always thought it was because I was a "visual learner" as opposed to an auditory one.  Maybe there is a link between introversion and visual learning (ie, we don't need to get our information from talking and conversation may overwhelm us, we prefer getting information from visual sources, like texts whereas extroverts may require social interaction because this is how they take in information, verbally, and would be lost if you handed them a textbook), but I doubt it is perfectly related.  Surely there must be extroverts who are visual learners and introverts who are auditory learners?  Any ideas on this?

[Victoria]

I'm also able to really relate to this.  At school I was very good at English, Art etc - but maths and science - they terrified me.  It was all too fast, I could never keep up.  If I didn't understand something straight away like the rest of the class - many teachers would lose their temper with me, I'd get upset - and it wasn't as if I wasn't trying!!  When you get treated like that from the early age of 7 or 8, all through school, it makes it so hard to learn.  I loved English/Art/Drama though, and that's where my fondest memories are when I think of school....  I wonder if I would have turned out differently (ie, better at maths/science) if anybody had recognised my innie-ness early on?!!
Victoria
INFP

[willowhirl]

I'm thinking along the same lines as innette...

I do think some of this has to do with learning styles...and not just based  solely on an extroversion/introversion issue.  And, again, we can't forget the interplay and impact the other scales (sensing/intuition, thinking/feeling, judging/perceiving) have on/with introversion or extroversion when thinking about our learning preferences.  The strength of each of the preferences can make a difference too. 

An ISTJ would likely have an easier time learning material that is matter-of-fact, detailed, practical, concise, sensory based, and concrete.   For them, sitting in an English Lit class where there is a lot of writing (or especially discussion) that focuses on interpretations could be pure torture.  However, an INTJ, because of their intuitive preference, may find listening to interchanges in the classroom quite stimulating as it fits with their type of mental processing (continual flow of ideas/insights/critical thinking).  They may not contribute as much to the discussion, but when they do contribute they will provide a unique perspective that hasn't been discussed or expand on one that has.  On the other hand, I think an ISTJ would have much more success (and enjoyment) in accounting or electronic type classes than an INTJ would.

When I was in college, I often found doodling (in between taking notes) helped me stay focused on the lecture.  Otherwise, I'd get distracted by what I'd written, things going on around me, or my internal thoughts.  To this day, when I am in seminars or at conferences, I still find doodling helps to keep my focus when (via boredom or frustration or tiredness) my thoughts want to go elsewhere. 

[mdfa]

Quote: I wonder if I would have turned out differently (ie, better at maths/science) if anybody had recognised my innie-ness early on?!!
Victoria

INFP

Victoria,



Absolutely! Let me describe my experiences in public school. I grew up in Poland where, at the time (30 years ago or so) school systems were totally geared towards the quick thinking extrovert. Part of your mark came from answering questions and solving math/science problems on the blackboard or in front of the whole class watching. Well, I'm sure you can imagine where that left me, especially in math and sciences. Language and humanities classes weren't too bad especially that I was leaning towards writing and reading a lot. But I was barely making a passing grade in math and hated it with a passion.



Now, there was this teacher in school that was hated/feared by just about all the students in the school. He was seen as extremely strict and hard nosed. He taught grades 7 and 8 math. But for some reason I always felt some kind of comraderee and affinity with him. Now I know it's because he was also a very strong introvert! So, when I barely made it into grade 7, I was actually looking forward to having him.



I will never forget the first class we had with him. The class was rowdy and talking when he walked in. He didn't tell us to be quiet but turned an overhead projector on and proceeded to "dust" it with a stuffed bunny while pretending to be very thorough about it. Everyone soon realized he was clowning and before I knew it, the whole class was roaring in laughter to the point that a lot of us, including me, had tears streaming down our cheeks. It was one of the best laughs I ever had.



He let this go on for about 5 min, then stopped, looked at the class, and all was silent. But everyone was also very relaxed. He proceeded to the lesson. I felt that i found a new hero.



He quickly realized that despite an almost failing mark in math, I had some potential and, as much as he could, he nourished it. He also must have subconsciously realized that I was like him - an initrovert and whenever I had to do the "stand up" testing, he always tried to give me time to think but at the same time tried to train me in thinking fast.



Very soon I had an eureka moment - math is very logical and FUN!!! And logic really spoke to me. Needless to say we became friends (as much as a kid and a teacher can) and I fell in love with logic. And I can honestly say that if it weren't for him I would not be able to work in computers, never mind passing high school...



So, to answer your question, I'm SURE you would have better math/science skills if someone recognized your personality and learning style.



Sorry for the book...

[innette]

mdfa, it's great to hear that you had such a nurturing teacher, and especially at such a helpful time!

My experience with elementary school may be a bit of an anomaly if the previous posts are pretty representative of the average introvert experience.  Oddly, I was pretty much the opposite of Victoria and mdfa: in the lower levels I was always totally on the ball, knew the answer before the question was even completed, learned decently by listening, etc.  I would say on most fronts I was also pretty introverted - always reading, hated recess, confident socially but generally avoided unnecessary social interaction.

But somewhere along the line I lost all of that.  Not totally sure how.  Maybe it's just because I learn well by being given a set of rules (axiomatic) and found elementary school easy so I never developed the ability to actually learn well.  I don't know, but midway through high school I found myself reading in class, drawing, copying down lectures but generally not paying attention and getting nothing out of class, and I've been that way ever since.  Would love to tap back into that academic skill I had at a young age, but I'm afraid it is either lost or merely an illusion.

 

[Victoria]

mdfa - thanks for sharing your thoughts! I didn't mention that a couple of years ago, I decided that I would figure out, once and for all, how to balance chemical equations (I could never get it to stick in my brain as a kid).  I found a website that explained it clearly, and I worked it out.  I was so thrilled! I'm about to begin a Uni. prep course in Archaeology as a lead up to commencing a part time degree - it'll be interesting to see how it all goes  (I'm 34 now, I finished school when I was 16).  Funnily enough, what you said about logic being FUN struck a chord.  A while ago I somehow found myself working in an IT environment (not anymore sadly), and I loved it.  I worked on a helpdesk for a govt. department and also did some web design work.  I found it so interesting and challenging.  It didn't work out, but I'm now working in a very different area, but still learning all the time.  Very mntally stimulating - I just love it!
Take care,
Victoria
INFP

 

The introverted process in learning

[Goat Rancher]

In my early years in school. I couldn't, for the life of me, figure out what all the, "routine", was for, in the daily school life. The teaching routine, was as if they took us around, and around, a bush, and then said,"O.K., onto the next subject." I kept waiting for them to pass onto us, some pertanant iformation, and I was being taken around, a bush. All the while, high pressure being applied, to my going around the bush. We'ren't they going to TEACH me ANYTHING? I finally, in frustration, asked the teacher, exactly that, and her reply was, "We're not supposed to give you the answers. That would be cheating. You have to get the answers, yourself". OOOOHHHH!!!, I didn't know we were playing a game, I thought we were all brought here, and 8 hours of each day taken up, in our being taught, SOMETHING! No one told me we were, ON OUR OWN!!! I can do, ON MY OWN, really well. I taught myself to read, I taught myself how to add, subtract, multiply, and divide. I read many books, and got the information on my own, in order to think and be creative in ideas, etc...and then test time came. I got a zero, because, I didn't properly fill out the heading of my paper. I had only written my name.
 Look. I have always, been able to take any information, and do some, HOMEWORK, and, like a football, take that info. and run it to the goal line, for a touchdown. That's never been a problem. I have been, and still am, enthusiastic, about learning, but I also, retain the aversion to, "being led in circles, around a bush.
 I taught myself to write the alphabet, by cheating, as the so-called-teacher, put it. My handwriting was atrociaous, and so, being sloppy, I wasn't allowed to participate w/the other children. So while they were all being led around the bush, I secretly copied every letter, onto little pieces of paper, and hid them away in my sweater pocket. I was terrified of being caught, cheating, as I was not going around the bush with the class, and I was FAILING to learn the alphabet through osmosus. I took the letters home, hid in the closet, and copied the leters, over, and over again, until I learned to write the entire alphabet, really well, or, at least, as well as I could. To this day, I've had people tell me, they have chickens that can scratch better, than me. In my adult life, I learned, I have dyslexia/disgraphia, as do my children, also.
 I was apparently, incorrect, as to what school was going to be. I went in, anticipating being imparted w/something sacred. KNOWLEDGE!!! What it was really about, was being taught to follow, THE ROUTINE. To do as I was told, otherwise, I'm bad. I was to learn to follow. If someone is to lead? The authorities will choose from among the fledlings.
 School was never about imparting knowledge, and it's still not, for the general population. But it used to, at least be good at inculcating the routine. Now, the school system isn't even good at that. But, it will absorb as much governmental funds, from the budget, as it can. -Goat Rancher